Conversations With Coffey

How To Lead A Franchise And Give Back - Dave Keil

• Guy Coffey • Season 1 • Episode 12

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In this episode, Guy welcomes franchise veteran Dave Keil to discuss his 38-year journey from Fortune 500 companies to leading franchises like Haagen-Dazs and Lash Lounge.

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We want to try to change the game and say no longer do you have to have half a million bucks in net worth. You can have 10, 000 of non gifted money and be awarded a franchise. We get hundreds and hundreds of franchisors or prospective franchisors that come to us every year at FranWorth. And those things that we select on, I would say, you know, that's what I would guide a franchisee to be thinking about as well.

They might not be able to get 

financed for a 900, 000 purchase. By a bank, I would bet on them in a heartbeat. They were 

really pushing on, Hey, I'll come in if you change the model. If you really go make the milkshake factory a drive thru, I'm in, I'll buy a bunch. And I think it might've been our first or second discovery day.

And you know, we said no. 

Hello and welcome back to the channel, Franchise Business Real Talk with me, Guy Coffey. And today I have a very special guest. Dave Kyle from Franworth and many other brands with me today. Dave has been in franchising for 38 years. 

Not quite that long, but it's been, it's been, I like to joke since the late 1900s, Guy.

That's the, 

that makes sense. Okay. Dave's background is, um, very varied. Many brands that people will recognize. Most recently, it's Franworth and their, their group of beloved brands. And I know that you're out of operations now. Congratulations on that, but you are on the board. So if you don't mind, um, I would love to start out with just a little bit of your background and talking about beloved brands at Franworth.

Great. Guy, thanks for having me on. Uh, appreciate it. Yeah, I'm my actually my career is a tale of two halves. The first half really was in Fortune 500 land. So 38 years is how long I've been working since out of university. The first half was at companies like Frito Lay, General Mills, a big chemical company called Ecolab.

The cool part about that is I did every job. So I was in finance, operations, sales, marketing, supply chain, the whole bit. So I got to do that, but I always wanted to be a CEO. And so that is what I made the jump into franchising. So I've been the lead of four different franchise brands. So the first one was Haagen Dazs Shops.

I don't know if you're an ice cream fan, but there you go. All right. So Haagen Dazs was the first one that was actually part of General Mills. That's really when I fell in love with franchising. The combination of entrepreneurs that we put in business, obviously, but also the systems and the processes.

I'm sure we'll talk more about that. So fell in love with it, uh, part of a big, huge, you know, fortune 200 company. Then I went and was the first kind of non family CEO of Honey Baked Ham. Again, don't know if you're a ham fan, there are about 400 of those units here in the States. So that was really my first CEO gig, got to lead the whole thing, be on the board, do all that stuff.

Then I went and ran a company called Pure Bar Boutique Fitness, uh, 600 units or so, 500 at the time, uh, PE held. So that was an interesting experience coming. So I did three in a row, one fortune, 200 lead one. Family led and then one private equity led. Uh, so that was, you know, interesting And then as we were joking, uh last time we spoke My I thought I was going to retire and move back to uh, my wife's uh from michigan I was going to move back to ann arbor where we met as undergrads and Really on a business trip to come.

Uh work on my house. I had known of john rachi And the fran worth team, but I never met john. So I set up a lunch and then a four, some, you know, four plus hours later, my wife's texting me going, Hey, what's going on? I'm like, no, it's all good. And he offered me to be the CEO of the last lunch that, you know, You know, that business and for me, that was exciting because at the time it had, uh, run, you know, still run by the founder, Vanna Phillips, so, you know, uh, and, uh, had 19 units open.

So I had never run an emerging brand like, and so that was what was super exciting and we can talk a bunch more about that. So those are the four, uh, businesses I led. And so I ran, uh, the Lash Lounge as CEO. Best thing we ever did was bring in Meg Roberts as our president, who's now the CEO. And, you know, I stepped in to lead FranWorth.

We can talk more about, uh, Franworth 

and what we do. Sure. Sure. Well, I I just wanted to kind of interject here for a second is when we first talked, I had seen, I had seen somewhere about you retiring and you corrected me. And I love this terminology. He's like, I'm not retiring. I'm just rewiring and doing something a little bit different.

That's true. Yeah. It's really, and for me, like a lot of us, I have been leading teams for 38 years. So it's been a long time. And my, my calendar. Is, was really not my own seven, eight meetings a day, you know, supporting seven brands a day to day leading a team. And so I look, I've got still a lot left to do.

I sit on the Franworth board and two other boards of, uh, businesses that are going to get into franchising that are not yet into franchising. So, uh, and then I've got a nonprofit, uh, that I lead that we can talk about later called franchise for good. So yeah, it's definitely a rewiring. Not a, I'm not just going to go play golf, although I am spending a bunch of time traveling.

And Google month. So 

as well, you should, as well, you should appreciate it. Um, just, uh, to brag on your accomplishments at Lash Lounge. I know you've had others before that as well. Um, but I think you took Lash Lounge from 19 units to over a hundred in. A really short amount of time. Yeah, 

we put on, I think we were 19 the first year in 2018.

We left the year at 61 open. Uh, and then I think we put another 35 or 40 on the next year. So we, we got to a hundred pretty quick. Yeah, and that was those were some fun times. That is for sure and happy to know I was just at their conference not that long ago, and they're very happy still which is the most important thing The franchisees are still, you know happy with the results and and you know many multi units that that you know signed on again When we had sold on their you know, their first uh few they're they're signing back up 

Yeah, I had the, uh, the, the terrific opportunity to be at the Lash Lounge conference in Mexico earlier this year, because it's a sister brand of Frenchies and the head to toe platform on Riverside now, and there was a lot of happy people there.

So it's, it's a really good, strong system with lots of momentum. I'm sure, you know, but just, just being around people in a social environment and hearing the conversations that franchisees and corporate people have. Folks have together. It was, it was really, really positive. 

Yeah. We've even got a few last time's franchisees that are coming to some art.

We have some other brands, one called sugaring LA in our platforms. We've got. A last line franchisee coming in and to be a franchisee of one of our kind of newer boutique beauty brands. So that, I think that says a lot as 

well. That makes a lot of sense. And then I would like to touch on Fran worse. I like your new platform name.

It's beloved brands. Yes. I like that. Like that has a good connotation. 

I'll tell you what that means. I mean, if that's okay, Aki. Please do. Yeah. So, so Fran worth has been around for almost 10 years. Okay. We're led by the founder, John Rotchie, who had this idea. He was the guy that started Fran Ship as part of the International Fran Transit Association.

So a way to mentor people. That's how he's wired. So that's how, why he created, uh, Fran Work was to go mentor franchisors, emerging franchisors. There aren't that many, as you know, companies out there that mentor emerging or just newer franchisors. So that was the idea. And then, so since then we've worked with some 20 brands.

Um, several of those have gone off and, you know, like the last lounge have gone off to different ownership. We have seven in the portfolio today and seven, you know, just either weren't ready, uh, or didn't do faint. We hit it that, you know, the market at the wrong time. Um, but the seven today, uh, are just wonderful.

They're all, they have three things in common. They all have wonderful founders. I know you're a founder. You and Stephanie, what you guys built at Frenchies is beautiful. And we think that's super important that the founders remain engaged in any of the brands with whom we partner. They've got great, you know, level economics, you know, got to the franchise units got to make money.

And so that's the one we sort for. And then it's got to have a unique end market. So it's got to have like, well, that's one thing I did like about what you built at Frenchies. No one was doing that. You know, the value proposition you had, there wasn't, it's a big market. You're in there disrupting it. We love that.

And so every one of our brands is doing that. I can run them quick and tell you what they are. Uh, yeah, there's seven real quick, uh, military factory. So we've sold over 116, 119, uh, and just started selling about a year ago. So that one's taken off for all those same reasons. Great founding, great, you know, level economics.

great in market. No one was really doing just milkshakes. Um, one called health source. So on the other end, that's 150 unit chiropractic chain, uh, health source chiropractic. So, you know, yeah, opposite of the value. And I saw you giggling at, um, but, but also from the size, I mean, been around 17, 18 years again.

Founder chris Tomshak still very well involved to service based businesses, one called mosquito necks. That does Um, mosquito, uh, system. So install systems that wrap around, not just fogging. Uh, and then Garage Kings, which is a garage floor coating business, as well as with cabinets and garage doors.

Sugaring LA. Uh, still in boutique beauty. Uh, again, that's a hair removal, but in a more natural way, sugaring is really beginning to take share from wax. Um, what called degree wellness. Our newest brand, um, that we just launched here about a month and a half ago. This is a wellness, a wellness base that's got cryotherapy, infrared sauna, cold plunge, uh, the red light therapy, those types of things just launched.

And then one we're about to launch is called the Laundry Spot. Which again, there's one launder lab, as you may know, is the competitor in the franchise space. But we love, love, love the laundry spot, what they're going to do. It's really, I mean, picture up what a best buy looks like, how light and airy. And bright and clean that is in a laundromat, which, you know, typically aren't known for that.

And so again, partnering with the founder, they're a great, uh, small system out of Ohio that we're going to go take national. So, so those are the seven with all those kind of very different, you know, from ice cream to yeah, to chiropractic care. But the only thing in common is they're all emerging brands and all, you know, a handful, uh, just getting going for the most part.

Great. 

Yeah. Well, thanks for running through them. I love that breath. And, um, but the, the commonality of, um, keeping founders involved and, um, you know, keeping the core together and selling on the merits of each one of the systems. 

And all wrapped around this infrastructure that Frameworth brings. The one thing we're trying to do different with Beloved Brands.

So that, it's a, we're still doing emerging brands, Guy. But one thing that we begin to notice, and you have seen this from being in the business, is that most franchisees need, you need half a million bucks. on the balance sheet to be able to get a shot. And so we recently, there are four of us that are the partners of framework, John Roche, who I mentioned myself, Drew Brees, the football player, American football player, who has also turned into an amazing franchise or and franchisee.

He joined us in 2019 on the cap table. But just earlier this year, we had a gentleman named Paul Blaven join us. So Paul is, like John and myself, a Michigan guy that went off Harvard MBA and started his own hedge fund and did an amazing job at a hedge fund with more than 2 billion under management. And in the last 15 years, he's just been giving back, turned into a philanthropist.

You know, when Paul found out about what we were up to, he said, You know what, you guys, yeah, you're good at incubating brands and growing them and supporting franchisors. and putting entrepreneurs in business. But he's like, you, you have a real opportunity to make a massive difference in more people's lives.

And so he started asking hard questions like, so why do you, you know, recommend that people are required that people have half a million dollar net worth? Uh, and it caught us, you know? And so what we decided to do again, what Beloved Brands is all about is really two things. One, our brand is being beloved by the end consumer.

So, you know, like it Frenchies. Like at the last lounge, people love the service they get and they're delighted. They go recommend it to others. You get great referrals. Um, and, and you want the end consumer to really feel like they're beloved. Um, sure. But then the other end of it, we want to try to change the game and say, no longer do you have to have half a million bucks in that worth.

You can have 10, 000. Of non gifted money and be awarded a franchise. So we'll be very selective. We're just building that system today to go figure out how, you know, we go find people and instead of using people's balance sheet as a measure of their potential to be an entrepreneur, I think what we're trying to do is say, Hey, should that be the measure?

Actually, you know, it should be about what's your leadership ability. What's your grit, you know, hungry, you are, can you dedicate, can you really be an owner operator and go, you know, put everything you've got into it. We've been inspired by what Chick fil A has done. Now it's going to start with Kathy and what he started.

long, long time ago. Uh, and what he, what they, what that company's built, you know, into, um, that's inspired us, but we're trying to now do it and they do it in one unit or one brand. We're going to try to do it across a portfolio of brands. So, you know, all the way from, you know, costume, maybe 150, 000 to get into a service based business all the way to, you know, a million and a half dollars to get into a, you know, one of our bigger units, like a laundry spot.

But we're really trying to change the aperture and let whomever. Can come in to be an entrepreneur. So that's what beloved brands is about. 

That is so cool. I was doing a little session on seller carry earlier today. Um, for resales, you know, that's, that's a real possibility where someone that's more qualified to actually run the business, like in, in fitness, you know, uh, uh, a personal trainer or someone that's actually like, in my case, run one of my gyms for five years, they might not be able to get financed for a 900, 000 purchase.

By a bank, but I would, I would bet on them in a heartbeat. You're 

right. You're right. And, and somehow industry has turned. It doesn't give enough people like that shot geek, you're right. On a resale, but to just out of the shoot, so it won't be easy. We'll have to do some training. And, but look, I think they'll come in with at least five years of work experience of lead things, have that drive grit, your, your example of about a fitness person, you know, that's led some teams in the space, you know, Giving them a shot.

That's what we're going to try to do is go, you know, give folks like that a shot 

I love that, you know when you look at Nothing wrong with banks or anything like that, but sometimes I've been on both ends of it where, you know, I've been where I, I did have capital and I still went to go borrow and I got what I wanted.

And other times when I really needed it and I didn't have enough and they're like, yeah, we would lend it. If you had this amount of collateral. And then I was like, well, maybe I wouldn't need a loan then, you know what I mean? So I love it where it's, um, opening it up to more people that to be honest, might be more qualified operationally.

And, you know, sometimes grit wise too, like if you grew up in it, like I just give the example of my, my one manager, like he's gone through every challenge that an owner would have gone through that, that gym is four hours from my home. He's a rockstar. Like he, he can own his own gym. He's handled everything.

He just hasn't had The opportunity yet and I hope he doesn't because I'm, I want to keep on growing it and give him an opportunity later, but there's nothing like that besides the Chick fil a, um, model. Um, and I just, I hope that goes well and you guys have the brain power to make it work. I'm sure. Yeah, we're, 

I mean, we're piloting it right now.

So we're, have got our first few people going through the pipeline and we're off doing a big fundraise to get, so we're back. We're heading off to a big meeting next week. So yeah, we're, we're confident this is going to work because everybody like you, people light up. They're like, yeah, someone needs to be doing that.

And so I think we'll figure it out. We'll be able to give great returns to the investor. You know, really, I mean, we think 15 plus IRR for the investor that comes alongside. Uh, we'll give people a living wage from day one, you know, at least 55 K depends, you know, 70 K out in California. So people will be able to make a living wage right away.

And then they'll, they'll invest back in and effectively buy. It'll be a called partner to own a partner to own program. So there'll be partners early on eventually. You know, after seven years, they'll own the unit. So, uh, we, we think that's a neat idea and it looks on paper, it looks like it works great.

We're going to, you know, we're going to test it out. 

Yeah. It all depends on those darn humans and how they show up. 

Yeah, exactly. And the coaching they get and all that other stuff. But yeah, for sure. 

So, um, I don't want to take up too much of your time and I, but I do want to get, um, just three questions answered.

And then I would love for you to just tell us a little bit about what you're doing, what you created out of your brain and put into reality. That's helping a lot of people in franchising. So with all of your experience in franchising, I just want to give something for each one of our listeners, perspective franchisees, current franchisees, and franchise systems.

So the number, the first question is, what do you see as the number one controllable aspect of a franchise system that impacts the success of its franchisees? 

Yeah, the, the support infrastructure of the franchisor Guy, I think is what it's all about. We, we, we get hundreds and hundreds of Franchisors or prospective franchisors that come to us every year at FranWorth.

And those things that we select on, I would say, you know, that's what I would guide a franchisee to be thinking about as well. I think the founder is super important. And I know I'm talking to a founder. Um, but, uh, you know, my experience, even at pure bar boutique fitness was the founder had been gone and the brand had lost its way.

So a founder or a founder role. That really is making sure the brand is being taken care of. And they re you really understand whatever it is from, uh, you know, eyelashes to, to nails, to, you know, milkshakes that someone really understands it and then that you've got a team behind you, uh, because that, you know, the data are great, right?

The data are in a, in a franchise backed system. Uh, you know, 85 percent of the, those businesses are still in business after 80 or after five years. Whereas I think it's something like 15%. sole proprietorship. So it's, but you gotta, it's gotta make sure the right people are behind it. And that's why we at Franworth love what we do.

We've been doing this a long time. This is what we're focused on. It's what I described back when I told you what got me so excited about Häagen Dazs was, yeah, we have entrepreneurs, but they're wrapped with processes and systems and people that have been there, done that. So even I spend a bunch of my time as I move into a new part of my career, still coaching, Our brand presidents.

Cause like you I've led this, I've led a franchise system. I know what's around the corner. And so I think sharing that stuff or the ops team saying, Hey, here's the KPIs or the legal team saying, here's what to watch out for, but just who's, who's behind it is the most important thing. 

That's a great answer.

Thanks for sharing that. Of course, the next one has to do with, um, franchisees, uh, over the years, you've probably worked with. Tens of thousands of franchisees. 

I 

was kind of thinking what's a realistic, I 

think that's probably right. Yeah. 

Right. Right. When you first meet someone, this might put you on the spot.

When you first meet someone, when they come in for, you might not be in these meetings anymore, but back in the day, you know, um, like you, you saw. 10 people come in for a discovery day or something like that. And you may, you might've had like a little, you know, three point highlight of what they've done in the past.

Was there anything that would stood out to you? Like, Oh, that gal, she's going to be a rock star or in this system or whatever the case may be. Was there any kind of clarity after all those years of. Being able to pick that out or was it still like, we'll see what happens as soon as they open. 

Yeah, no, well, it's awful tough to do that.

Gee, as you're, which is we're reinventing that with beloved brands. So we're going through that right now. We're trying to say, Hey, what questions could we ask in a survey? You know, what, how do we get to it? Do a behavioral interview. So we've actually, we've engaged Gallup. We've engaged, uh, this guy named Doug Harrison, who wrote the rise framework to go help us.

He's done this for. A bunch of Fortune 100 companies to go to get at those Guy questions. And really, I think what it comes down to is it, is that grit. Gee, I know that's hard to, to identify, but you know, we're gonna ask things about, hey, when you've been hit with something that's, you know, been a challenge, how do you react?

You know, how do you react to that? Are you resilient? Have you done it in your past? My guess is most successful franchise. E's have not been handed life and opportunity on a silver platter all the time, right? They've worked through stuff. We all have. But how you do that? I also test for people that are going to be able to follow the system, Guy.

So we had, uh, I have gone to Discovery Days, I've been to, I don't know, you know, one a month this year, uh, at least. So I've seen them from, you know, probably six of our different brands and the ability to follow the system and that balance of bringing their own, you know, local adoption, adaption ideas about how they're going to go put it into Raleigh Durham or whatever, because they're going to be the mayor of the brand there.

But more importantly, can they really follow the system? So we had one of our. Our businesses, they were really pushing on, Hey, I'll come in if you change the model, right? If, if you really go make the milkshake factory a drive thru, I'm in I'll buy a bunch. And I think it might've been our first or second discovery day.

And you know, we said, no. You know, it would have been okay if they asked once. We're like, no, we're not going to do it. We we've been proving this out for 15 years. So we're going to yes, someday, but not immediately. So someone like that's, it's not going to be a good fit, right? We want people that are entrepreneurial, that they can lead and face uncertainty and operate through the gray.

But also someone that will follow a system. So I'm always looking for that. Are they bucking it? Are they going to be bucking the system too much? Cause they'll look, they'll just be frustrated. Right. If that's, it's not a good thing, they should go do their own thing. And so they can go get promoted to founder of their own thing.

Exactly. 

You want to change the system and go create it, right? Yeah, you're 

right. There you go. 

So the last question has to do with, you know, um, you know, We, we, we sold Frenchies to a platform that was building out a beauty brand platform. Um, Stephanie and I had been looking for that. We thought that was a great idea.

We still, we still do. Um, and you have the same thing with brands joining your platform. Um, of that for franchisees looking at systems, if they say like, Oh, you're standalone, that's, that's, what's good about that versus like, Oh, you're part of this platform. Does that reduce my risk somehow? Or what, what do you think, what do you see as the advantages of, uh, joining a system that's part of a brand, uh, a part of a portfolio?

You know, not just a standalone, 

you know, and I, I get this question often, uh, from candidates in discovery days. So I, and we do, you know, talks and all that stuff about them. So, um, I haven't put it in three different categories. Guy in this, I think franchise systems earlier, the reason framework exists is because we, uh, coach and mentor and incubate emerging brands.

So I think in that, those early days, I mean, Stephanie did that. You guys are the exception. Like you did an exceptional job, uh, about supporting it. What Framework does is comes alongside groups like yours, like Franchise at the time and partners with founders. Yes, we take equity. So we're not for everybody.

Um, but you know, build the processes and systems. So I, I think that's an important thing. If you're, if a prospective franchisee is looking at a system. Back to what I originally said, you got to look at who's behind it, and then I think a system that's, um, so a standalone will work well if it's got the proper support behind it.

Experience people in two areas. One, the whatever the offer is, the eyelash extensions, the milkshakes, the garage floor coating. So you've got to have that technical expertise. Depth, but also scaling expertise, because most every business we come into, we change the point of sale system. We make sure we're putting in great KPIs.

We're fixing, you know, making opportunity or optimizing the supply chain, and we're doing that proactively. You know, and investing behind it proactively, the, the, the benefit that a portfolio, uh, company gives you is I think even greater gain. And look, we sold the last lounge to the same private equity firm that you sold, uh, franchise to, uh, part of it is to make sure that we use the franchise or really wanted to make sure we're taking care of franchisees and that private equity group to whom we sold, who's now created head to toe with Meg Roberts at the helm.

We'll do great because they get it. They really are about supporting the franchisee, but I think what's even better, we, we try to do this and something I've been working on for more than two and a half years now within Fran Worth is cross pollinating ideas among the different brands in the portfolio.

That's the fun stuff. Just like franchisees cross pollinate ideas, the franchisors do it. So we just had a couple of weeks ago, I had all the brand presidents in town to Ann Arbor. It was a wonderful day because the brand presidents who, it gets lonely at the top, as you know, they get a minute and they spend a whole day and a half of just, Picking off other ideas and collaborating.

We have a big, long text stream that goes when somebody faces an issue or has just a simple question being part at every level. So we do that at the president's level. We do it, the marketers, uh, they all meet every month, all the marketers across the portfolio. And then the ops people meet the ops leaders of the franchise or me.

So we're sharing best practices. They're not in it alone. And so I think those are the benefits from being in a portfolio if that stuff's done, right? If that stuff's done, if those ideas get cross pollinated, right? 

Yeah. I love it. It's like mastermind groups where you can find a, there's so many similarities between it doesn't matter if it's a milkshake factory and a degree wellness.

Some of the same challenges, business challenges are happening in both. 

That's it. Yeah. The YPO's, the masterminds, the all that stuff. Yeah. We, in fact, that's what we are calling this effectively is a mastermind. The head of HealthSource, our chiropractic business, Chris Tomshack, Dr. Tomshack has been doing masterminds with his franchisees for a decade.

So we're just, I just, I'm just. Try to steal as much as I could from him and do it with the brand president. 

Steal from the best.

That's great. So before we wrap up, I just wanted to give you a platform for your, this franchising for good that when you told me about it, it was just. In summary, it was like, I had this idea, wanted to see if it would work. And then the last part of the story was, and now Notre Dame is trying it out too.

And I was like, what does this tell us a little bit 

about you? I'd never been a founder, honestly. I'd been the guy that came behind. All these brands, these amazing brands I work with, I've never been the founder, but I've been around people like you. I've been around founders. And so I, I was trying to, I'm turning 60 actually tomorrow.

So, I mean, I'm hitting a big milestone. Thank you. And so five years ago, I like, all right, I'm certainly need to be making sure that I've had some success in my career. How do I go do something more significant? That'll live beyond me. And the idea I had, really it was a literal walk through the woods at my cabin in northern Michigan was, Hey, what if we applied all the tools and processes and systems that we apply and use in franchising every day?

You do, we do, every brand does. And apply that to the non profit space. Would that work? So that was the hypothesis. So instead of like what I would normally do, like, you know, studying it for two years and beating it up, I just did it. I started Franchise for Good right in the middle of COVID as a non profit, a 501c3 that I funded to start and then said, Hey, look, I want to go try this.

That's the hypothesis. So I got really lucky. My first brand was Colorado Homebuilding Academy that Was owned effectively by Berkshire Hathaway. So got kind of lucky with that one. You know, Warren Buffett's group, that 

small little company that, 

yeah, the guy that started it works for Warren Buffett, one of his, I don't know, 14 direct reports, um, and he had this trade job training school in Colorado.

That we ended up long story short, replicating, uh, and Fran and franchising and nonprofit world is called chapter affiliate program. So think about like boys and girls clubs, national chapter, local affiliate. We created one of those. Now there's eight of them drew breeze. In fact, my partner opened the first pilot in new Orleans, and now we have eight open around the country with a goal of training a million people in the trade.

So plumber, carpenter, that type of thing. And then, yeah, fast forward. I've worked with 18 brands now. Um, and Notre Dame found out what we were up to and they have this really cool think tank geek called Leo lab for economic opportunity that study. nonprofit. So if your nonprofit is uses early childhood education to go improve test scores or poverty, they actually go in and study it over time and actually prove that it does actually get impact.

And so they do a wonderful job. These academics about proving it with data, these things called random control trials and publish things in their journals. But they were never putting that to action that you or I would to say, well, what if we went and did that? If it's working in, you know, San Diego, what if it would go work in Maine?

Like, let's go put it everywhere. So we partnered about two years ago. Uh, and we've worked, I think with eight different brands to help them go replicate ones that have proven to work. And now we're the body that's helping them go replicate. So it's really neat. You know, it's been such a blessing to work with Notre Dame and now I've got, they have 90 of these.

So I've got unlimited deal flow, right? So I can go work with whomever we want. So we're trying to figure out how we ramp up franchise for good. So we can go help out. Wow. 

Too bad. You guys don't have an in at the university of Michigan or something like that. 

Actually I put them to work, man. I totally do.

I, uh, they, in fact, one of the things we do just like in franchising, um, we're working with one of ours right now, actually two of them, one called empower. That, um, takes, uh, out of Brooklyn, New York. They, they teach folks how to code. So they come in not knowing how to code, uh, making on average 6, 500 bucks a year.

They leave 20 weeks later, making 65, 000 bucks a year. So we're trying to go put these all over the U S. And actually I've got a Michigan group doing a market assessment saying, Hey, where, what market should they be at? 

Well, I love it. I mean, there's, there's so much there for, for improvement and improving people's lives.

And, you know, from that story, I'll go from a walk in the woods to Notre Dame to, uh, the biggest thing that jumps out is like, you might impact over a million people. That's a big deal. So thanks for doing that. Well, thanks Keith. 

Appreciate 

it, man. Yeah. 

Yeah. 

Appreciate 

you. 

And And I wanted to thank you for being on, being on the show, sharing your experience, um, we'll have all links to you so that people can look at Franchise for Good, um, Two Arbors, um, Franworth, things like that.

Um, and, uh, just can't thank you enough for doing what you've done in franchising and turning it around and giving back as well. Um, It's, it's really impressive and we need more people like you. So thank you very much. 

Oh, thank you, Guy. And thanks for what you're doing about getting the word out. I think this is important as well to, you know, get, you know, to franchisees, prospective franchisees, all the people you're touching too.

So thanks for what you're doing. 

My pleasure. Thanks Dave.